@aliza1999

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aliza1999

Natural remedy for fatigue??

I am newly diagnosed with CIS. My original symptoms (right leg and arm issues) have completely remitted, but I am still so very tired all the time. Has anyone had any luck with natural remedies for fatigue? I take herbs daily to help boost my immune system as everyone around me is sick. I have been very lucky so far and have remained healthy. My only complaint (I feel guilty when I see so many others going through so much more) is fatigue. Any advice?

cherish

@cherish

@aliza1999 I went down the prescribed route of modafinil for years but I've now changed to pharma grade biotin. I wouldn't like to say as yet if its working or not as I've only been it a couple of months. I was taken off modafinil as they thought that that particular medicine was making my low mood worse? Gotta trust them I guess hence the alternative route. Good luck, and hope someone else that has more biotin expertise than me can help. Lisa xx

aliza1999

@aliza1999

@cherish - Thanks for the advice about biotin. I remember reading about it last year when my Neuro first starting suggesting I might have MS. I am going to research it. Thanks again! Michelle

Margarita

@Margarita

Apparently plenty of water helps with fatigue. I've been drinking a lot for my treatment and have noticed some difference on days I've lapsed. Might be obvious but it wasn't to me until I read it! Oh also, re: immune boosting, might that aggravate MS? Not sure how that works alongside various medications, might be worth a look into. Vitamin D is balancing rather than boosting, but there's a list out there somewhere with more info. Maybe on the MS society website?

aliza1999

@aliza1999

@margarita My Neuro feels the herbs I take won't affect the CIS at this point. I have to say that once I started taking them again my symptoms started to resolve. It was very strange. They were worse for a day or two, but then completely remitted within a week. It could be a huge coincidence, but knowing how sick everyone has been I'm taking my chances. I am not on any meds at the moment, still waiting for Copaxone to be approved by my insurance and started. That should happen in the next week or so. Once I have that arranged, I will ask the nurse if there are any issues with taking herbs with Copaxone. The Neuro felt they were safe and felt it was very important that I stay healthy. So far, so good! From what I've read, the herbs "might" exacerbate MS symptoms, but at the moment I have no symptoms other than fatigue. I did decide to skip the herbs last night but I am just as tired today as ever. I will skip one more night to see if the fatigue improves. The fatigue just started over the weekend. I was feeling great until then. Then wham!! I am dealing with a lot of stress at the moment, so that probably isn't helping.

Victoria5905

@Victoria5905

Glad to hear the herbs were a remedy :) Can I point you to "MS Cure" and "Dr Swank" conversations? In them are lots of information about non-drug therapies. If you need a quick fix go vegan. Your MS thinks that animal proteins are foreign so kick starts your immune system hence why relapses occur. Margarita is right, Vitamin D is very worthy, I take 5000 iu a day. Along with Omega 3 and B12. Looking at "overcomingms" website could prove very useful. If you want more information on natural remedies.

cherish

@cherish

@Victoria5905 I dunno owt about diets, I have no desire to know nowt neither. But, we try to eat healthy and moderate what we eat, but, if I thought for one single minute that a certain diet will 'cure' ms then I feel we would have all cured ourselves years ago, years and bloody years ago. I know it's your belief and I don't want to strip you from that, good on you if the diet is your path, but some of us need management drugs or we suffer tremendously. Good luck Victoria. Love Lisa xxx

Victoria5905

@Victoria5905

Yes Cherish if you can't have a vegan diet explore drugs. I can't put anything into my mouth that causes my MS to play up. But good luck to you if you do, Vicky

cherish

@cherish

My profile sez it all!! These are all the meds that dampen my symptoms. Ok, mabye others will despute some meds. Without particular ones I can't function. I don't fancy telling my ms team that they have put me down the wrong route! I know they havnt. But, not once in years and years have any of my team said 'go vegan and Itl cure you'. Why do neuros not tell us that a simple diet will cure?? So they did 10yrs training yet still don't bring up 'cure', so if the cure is 'vegan' why do you know that and the professionals don't? I dunno!

Victoria5905

@Victoria5905

Easy understanding to have, the Dr Neuros have spent many years training in medical school and have not learnt about nutrition and the benefits it brings. They haven't spent time on it so will not advocate it. You know doctors thought tomatoes were poisonous in America?

cherish

@cherish

Il tell my Neuro she is useless for not training herself on 'vegan cure'??? Bet I wouldn't have care no more. Vegan cure is simple! But ms, wether you like it or not dosnt have a cure as of yet! Will vegan 'cure' my bladder and bowel that dosnt function? Will vegan keep my optic nerves healthy? Will vegan let me walk up and down steps? Will vegan stop my pain? Will it stop my depression and my crying! Sorry, I'm out on this one! Fill yer boots!

Victoria5905

@Victoria5905

MS therapy is subjective, if you feel drugs are the best option- go for it and I hope you feel better. But how about trying it- lessening your saturated fat intake? You will feel better. I know that from your gut reaction to animal proteins.

cherish

@cherish

So the cure is vegan? Is that 100% defo? Ok..... I sez to myself I wasn't coming back on this thread but I'm now daring myself to call my ms team 'shite bags' for not educating themselves properly?? Is that what you are suggesting??

yuma

@yuma

@cherish I think you might be a bit overly defensive, no one is telling you that your MS team are crap for not advocating about a vegan diet, just saying it's not something you would normally hear from healthcare professionals. Personally, I am a v unhealthy eater and my nurse is constantly nagging at me to make my diet a little better because she said it will help me. But yeah, anyway, no one is telling you to switch to vegan or die! It's just helped a lot of people so they're suggesting it to you too. :)

Victoria5905

@Victoria5905

I definitely don't think you should call them "Shite bags" :) Your medical team knows about medicine so they wouldn't have considered nutrition playing a part. They're MEDICAL not NUTRITIONAL so it's not their fault. More info here: https://www.drmcdougall.com/health/education/health-science/featured-articles/articles/mcdougall-interview-with-dr-roy-swank-md/ This site might ease your mind regarding nutrition and MS http://www.pcrm.org/health/health-topics/treating-multiple-sclerosis-with-diet-fact-or Diet has a higher success rate than drugs.

cherish

@cherish

Ofcourse I wouldn't! They are the ppl we rely on. Your Neuro clearly has educated themselves on 'vegan cure'. Good on ya!

Victoria5905

@Victoria5905

No my neuro hasn't said anything to me. When I told him I wanted to end my DMT he had the opinion that I'd be back. (I wasn't) I found out about how plant based diet can improve MS by myself through watching films and reading articles. You do whatever you feel best, I wish you the best luck :) Vicky x

Victoria5905

@Victoria5905

Reading the comments for "The Multiple Sclerosis Diet Book" is interesting. I think. http://www.amazon.com/The-Multiple-Sclerosis-Diet-Book/product-reviews/0385232799

Margarita

@Margarita

Diets and other lifestyle changes certainly have their place and probably even deserve further study... I think what gets people hot under the collar is the idea that it's a cure. Especially based on anecdotal evidence (as far as I'm aware, anyway). Feeling better in the short term, or even going years without a relapse, is no guarantee of long term good health up there under the hood. That just makes it hard to ignore the science and the neuros (and pharma, gotta love those swell guys) and gamble on something else. It's a long term game (and isn't it so much fun?!) we're all playing with no do-overs. I'm as guilty as anyone of being passionate about a treatment choice that I dearly hope might help others, so I understand it coming from a good place though :)

Victoria5905

@Victoria5905

Cure from MS is years away. By eating a vegan diet and having no relapses until then will prevent any damage incurred. Ask someone from the medical community about a link between MS and food and they won't know. Sad because there is a biological link between food and symptoms. Actual proof. But treatment choice is individual. I wouldn't want to "gamble" on drugs that lessen my immune system by decreasing the amount of white blood cells I have. But that's my choice. Other treatment options exist and the PR surrounding them is impressive. I too am passionate, I wish I knew something so simple could be used to combat MS before I started sticking needles in my skin. Again- everyone should make up their minds and choose the treatment that feels "right". Vicky

Stumbler

@Stumbler

@victoria5905 , will you be careful of phrases, such as, "By eating a vegan diet and having no relapses until then will prevent any damage incurred"? I agree that having no relapses will prevent any damage, but going vegan does not ensure the prevention of relapses, does it? That is unless you can give us a categoric, unequivocal assurance where we could sue you for compensation if we did relapse................... :roll:

Victoria5905

@Victoria5905

I'm sorry, maybe I should have added "probably" to what I said. The experiment was entitled "Multiple sclerosis and nutrition" Feb 2009 I'm just sharing what I found on PubMed: "...It seems possible that in the future, diets or dietary supplements may become recommended forms of treatment for MS." As I've stated before, I believe in diet improving MS but everyone should decide for themselves to get the best fit at tackling this horrible disease. OK don't worry, I'll leave the site. Just wanted to help with an alternative therapies :) Vicky

Stumbler

@Stumbler

@victoria5905 , no-one is asking you to leave. You may just want to consider curbing your enthusiasm, as your message came through the first time. :oops:

Victoria5905

@Victoria5905

Sorry, I'm too enthusiastic about diet. Especially after learning about deaths caused by MS Drugs when a simple diet could perform better. And bring HUGE happiness when you don't have relapses :D

Victoria5905

@Victoria5905

Diet wins hands down george1234 over drugs. 70% decrease in relapses. Although not an immediate cure (it takes 19 years before signs of ms are traceable) it can immediately ease symptoms. Alright alright alright... I've made my point :)

Victoria5905

@Victoria5905

Vegan is excellent. Or eating a plant-based diet (same thing but that sounds cooler apparently) Aim of the game is to not eat saturated fat, these found in animal protein. Avoid dairy. Milk, cheese have alternatives Red meat is a definite no. Not worth the risk- MS or heart disease. Eggs is just meat in an oval, it holds the same dangers to MS patients. Milk also carries dangers for MS patients- it looks innocuous but don't drink a sip. Your tummy will feel like it's being invaded and signal for the immune system to spark up. Cue relapse. I'm going to heat up vegan szechuan stir fry (most my meals are defrosted during the week) find recipes and batch cook at the weekend. This is a great vid to watch to get you started https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=AAkEYcmCCCk The Swank diet does allow a small amount of fat (chicken breast and other small amounts of meat. You could find out more here http://www.swankmsdiet.org/ Don't rush into it if it's too bigger change, take baby steps and substitute meat with alternative like quorn to begin with. Milk def can be changed though, good luck! Vicky

cherish

@cherish

Good evening to you @victoria5905 I did an hour of reading your links etc today! Again, I don't wish to strip you of your belief, again, good on you. We all need to believe in something to help us through this bloody tornado of a disease. But without looking back, (meaning I'm sorry if this isn't precisely what you said), but you mention ms, drugs (meds) and deaths. Can I ask you what you meant? Do you mean ppl that die bcoz of the disease modifying therapys, or the meds they are prescribed, or both? Thanks. Also, if you suddenly go downhill, say next week things started to get so hard, you have one relapse after another after another and you are say left with nothing down one side, no arm movement, no leg, can't make it to toilet etc,,,,,, Then your Neuro or ms specialist doctor said 'Victoria, we would like to start you on lemtrada or hsct to avoid things getting worse'. Do you mean you would 100% say no as you believe the diet can do more than the treatment offered? I'm trying to understand! I am. But I'm maybe not to clever. Should have sez earlier, my daughter called Victoria and you know, you actually look similarish! Have a good evening Vicky. Although my daughter gets called Toria! I changed her name legally when she was 16, cost a pretty penny. She sez Victoria to old fashioned and stamped her feet for years, lol. Love Lisa xxx

simone2

@simone2

Hi aliza1999, I take chlorella which is a algue and is a strong antioxidant it really helps with my fatique and I also follow a low fat,no dairy,no sugar diet and for me it really helps. Sue

lilbird

@lilbird

Hi all, just wanted to say a couple of things... Firstly some simple changes in diet can make surprisingly big differences to all kinds of health issues but much as meds aren't the whole picture neither is diet so maybe we should all be equally open to the benefits of both. Secondly a sudden complete change in diet, particularly something as dramatic as switching to a vegan diet after years of eating meat, dairy, etc is potentially quite dangerous if not acheived slowly& gradually. Basically don't just throw out the contents of your fridge & try & do it all in one go but make it a gradual transition& possibly get the advice of someone in a professional capacity to be certain you have all your nutritional needs covered. The last thing you need on top of all the fun & games of MS some unexpected reaction to a dramatic change lifestyle. And thirdly, please do correct me if I'm wrong but I'm pretty sure that even though finding something that works for you so that you have no more relapses is great it's not true that no relapse=no damage... is it?

lilbird

@lilbird

Ooops, I knew there was more, @cherish when you say pharma grade biotin is that something that you are prescribed or that you buy yourself? I'm guessing it's a lot stronger than the stuff you can pick up in Boots? :P :)

cherish

@cherish

Goodevening to you @lilbird I order pure powder but I can't get it in the UK. I'm not very sure how to send you the link but I order from bulksupplements.com It's in Nevada US. It comes fairly quick and has been a hastle free transaction every time. I just use PayPal and for a months worth (if you want to do the 300mg daily) costs £27 and that includes delivery. You will need scales for weighing. I think mines was just around £5/6 online. Hopefully that's of help to you and I hope you're having a nice evening. Lisa xxx

Victoria5905

@Victoria5905

No problem george1234 I believe Norway has a lower incidence of MS which scientists believe is down to their oily fish diet. Salad is cool, but plenty of plants though too, "Bill's" restaurant have a fantastic green salad. @cherish- I forgot to include link to MS Drug death count http://articles.mercola.com/sites/articles/archive/2012/02/09/why-did-ms-drug-kill-eleven-people.aspx (from 2012 so I not sure if there have been any more)

lilbird

@lilbird

Ta for that @cherish ;) So if this stuff comes as a powder how do you take it? Does it have to be mixed into a liquid or food? Thanks @victoria5905, I rarely drink any kind of milk these days & find that most "meat substitutes" are made from things I can't eat so I read a lot & make changes & add supplements where I can. Have you had any experience with coconut oil? It's just recently come on to my radar & seems to bring some fab benefits with regard to brain health! I'm still doing the reading though but take a look, see what you think. :) @Stumbler, I figure you'd know, or know where to check... pretty sure it's not true that no relapse=no damage is it? I await your always interesting links :D

Stumbler

@Stumbler

@lilbird , it was good of you to join this conversation to provide a rational view. I'd hate to think of members suddenly switching to a totally diverse diet with the expectation that their MS, a progressive neuro-degenerative condition, would stop. And, yes, there has been some over-enthusiasm. Does no relapse-no damage? I think not - how would this explain the progressive forms of the condition? So thanks for bringing the realism.

cherish

@cherish

Good evening to you @lilbird I just weigh my powder out, pop it in a water bottle, splash of diluting juice (as it tastes very askit powdery) and let that last me from morning till bedtime. Yeah, I drink other things throughout day but just sip away at the biotin. It can be a little fidgety with the powder but as long as you don't suffer hand tremors etc it's easy peasy. I believe there's others here that do do the tablet form. Think @Orlando27 poss does the tablet form from Amazon. It depends what suits you best. I'm not sure the amount of tablets it is a day, I know it's a considerable amount, it's another option for you if you don't want 'scales and white powder', lol. Love Lisa xxx

lilbird

@lilbird

@Stumbler, thankyou very much for saying that. I did type a longer reply when you posted, saying that & various other thing but seem to have made it vanish somehow instead of submitting & decided I didn't have the patience to try doing remembering it all to try again! :/ Thanks @cherish, sounds interesting. Don't have tremors just clumsy & little sensation & have to be looking at them to know what they're doing! Funny you should mention Amazon, I've been having a look on there at various supplements as it's easy & I'm lazy :P but not sure about ordering, can you be sure you're getting what the description says? I guess it depends on the company? Not sure why I've ended up directing this at you @cherish- don't panic, someone else will probably know :P :D

Stumbler

@Stumbler

@lilbird , as far as obtaining supplements, you could always consider:- http://www.hollandandbarrett.com/ ; or http://www.healthspan.co.uk/ . Both are UK companies, who may take a bit more interest in their suppliers. Not that Amazon don't.......

lilbird

@lilbird

Thanks @Stumbler I've just posted a new thread :) Not sure how they check their suppliers or how reliable any of it is, but they must do... right??